Once a close SDA relative of mine told me that if the entire Bible was found to be phony, if everything on earth and heaven disappeared that the Ten Commandments would still be there. He even insisted that God Himself is subject to His own laws, THE TEN COMMANDMENTS.
Adventists build a great deal of their remnant status doctrine from the Revelation 12 text that says the remnant are those who keep the commandments of God and the testimony of Jesus. Somehow keeping Sabbath (4th commandment) proves that their church alone fulfills this prophecy because all other denominations keep only nine of the Ten Commandments (they don’t rest on Saturday, but worship on Sunday--breaking the fourth commandment.)
While I would dismiss the premise on many levels, for argument sake, let’s analyze this idea.
Adventists claim they keep ALL ten.
We could spend some time explaining how teaching all Ten Commandments is vastly different from the text that claims the remnant keep all ten. So do all members of the church honor their parents? No one has ever committed adultery? or stolen? Do Adventists keep ALL Ten Commandments? My guess is no. So preaching all ten is very different from keeping them and if they don’t keep them ALL perfectly--then they are no different than anyone else. They just fail at keeping ten instead of fail at keeping nine. But that is not the point I want to make.
Adventist do not even believe in all Ten Commandments. They have flagrantly thrown out the sixth commandment (Commandment 5 for Catholics.) “Thou shalt not kill.”
Adventists have no doctrine against abortion. They have a wishy-washy text that suggest “guidelines” for abortion--it is not even listed under “official statements” on their website:
http://www.adventist.org/beliefs/guidelines/main_guide1.html
The text of the guidelines are carefully crafted to allow for members to be either pro-choice or pro-life. I know, I was on the 1988 committee held at Loma Linda University, chaired by Albert Whiting that sent recommendations to the GC Executive Committee that ended up being the 1992 Abortion Guidelines.
The guidelines do not state that abortion is wrong, that it is against the fourth commandment. It contains expressions like, “Abortion is one of the tragic dilemmas of human fallenness.... Attitudes of condemnation are inappropriate in those who have accepted the gospel." The Adventists would NEVER suggest this sentence for the fourth commandment. “The decision to worship on Sunday is a tragic dilemma of human fallenness... Attitudes of condemnation for those who choose to worship on Sunday are inappropriate in those who have accepted the gospel.”
Adventists do not seem to have a problem with standing firm for the fourth, but not the sixth commandment. The published abortion guidelines are practically immaterial because they are a “front” for a hospital system that can choose to abide or disregard them. Some Adventist hospitals perform abortions -on-demand and are used by doctors to even do late-term abortions.
The church and its members are intimately connected with the abortion business. SDA Pastor George Gainer presented a paper at Loma Linda University in 1988 at an ethics meeting chaired by David Larson. It reported the story of how the SDA Hawaiian Conference paved the way for legalized abortion in that state that eventually spilled over to the mainland’s Roe vs. Wade decision. Adventists have ping-ponged back and forth through its history on the abortion issue. Adventists pioneers taught abortion was nefarious murder. Then it flew to the other side where during the 1960's the General Conference President, Neil Wilson, made a public statement that because of world overpopulation the Adventist church comes down on the side of legalized abortion.
In 2000 I was told by Dr. George Reid (director of the SDA Biblical Research Institute a theological branch of the General Conference) that not only is the church pro-choice but that “Washington Adventist Hospital had become an abortion mill.” Jan Paulsen’s secretary also told me that Adventists are “pro-choice.”
Most recently, Irving “Bud” Feldkamp, owner of the nation’s largest privately-owned abortion chain (17 family planning clinics) and member of the Adventist church made news. His two daughters, two sons-in-law and five grandchildren were killed in a Montana plane crash.
http://www.christiannewswire.com/news/646579835.html
http://news.adventist.org/2009/03/in-us-three-adventis.html
This is how the Adventist News Network reported it:
Three Seventh-day Adventist families are among the 14 victims killed in a March 22 airplane crash in Butte, Montana. All three families were members or regular attendees at congregations in Northern California (they also reported that several of the victims had attended SDA colleges.) ...Church officials said the tragedy was a loss to the Adventist community.
While we would not expect the SDA church to announce two of the families were children of Bud Feldkamp, notorious employer of abortionists who continue to butcher thousands of innocent children and who most likely gives blood money to the church, the fact that the family held such close ties to Adventism makes one wonder why the SDA church hasn’t loudly protested against Feldkamp's profession.
Dr. Edward Allred, also raised SDA and graduated at an Adventist University, was for many years the nations foremost abortionist and is rumored to have sold some of his abortion clinics to Bud Feldkamp.
Those who believe Adventists to be the only church to promote all Ten Commandments need to rethink their position. As long as they continue to cave on the sixth commandment, as long as they allow abortions in their hospitals and don’t stand against the abortionists and abortion clinic owners who consider themselves SDA, they really have no higher ground position on the Ten Commandments than any other church.
Those Adventists who think like my relative are really in trouble because they are basing their beliefs on sandy ground. So if you are looking for a church who keeps the Ten Commandments in order to the be the official remnant church of Revelation 12, Adventism would not be it. The Seventh-day Adventist church is making a very false claim. They could not be the remnant any more than any church who--as they insist the prophecy states doesn't keep all the Ten Commandments.
Adventists really only keep nine.....
11 comments:
I really treasure the seventh Day Adventist church because of its firm stand on Gods laws(commandments) and hereby would like to correct that the church do keep all the ten commandments including the one in Question of not killing which abortion is one of the killing methods plus others not mentioned, the fact that the church has not (as you claim) come out clear as compared to the catholic about abortion does not mean that the church promotes it, no. Abortion, Murder etc are all sorts of killing that the commandment says. Bye the way do you know that even hating your brother is killing? so killing is not limited to physical action alone.
That is the stand and teaching of the church, but i would like to say that if you see some members of the church not doing as per the instruction given in the bible know that that is his/her own stand but not the church. Also remember that all have sinned and are sinning every now and then, but in need of the saving grace of God. i humbly request you not to generalize an individuals acts or deeds to the church (whichever church, be it Catholic, AIC, Pentecostal, SDA etc. Gods commandments are there to stay as long as we are still in this world of sin until when Jesus will come for the saints and Satan destroyed.
Clifford,
The official church position is that of pro-choice. That is against the 6th commandment. So it is intellectually dishonest to claim the SDA church keeps all ten. The Seventh-day Adventist church does NOT in doctrine or in corporate behavior promote all TEN, only nine.
Therefore their premise of being the remnant based on keeping all ten is not factual.
I totally agree that SDA's have a very embrassing legacy of promoting Sabbath way above and beyond all else.
I you could also include their deceptive tactics on evangelization and Ellen Whites writing's status as being dishonest. ...so I guess now their only keeping 8 commandments.
Thank you for pointing this out Teresa. I feel that this issue really needs to be brought out amongst Adventists who seem all to ready to sweep it under the rug.
To Clifford:
Can you provide any offical statements from the SDA GC that specifically renounce abortion? Can you site any active pro-life work done by the denomination or any Adventist pro-life groups. I believe that we should know them by thier fruit. So where's the fruit Cliff?
God bless,
Alex
this is an amazing post to me.
just yesterday i was praying to discover an SDA who entered the RCC!
i had heard about the crash in montana, right into a catholic cemetery, but never realized it was an adventist abortionist!
thanks for this public service!
PS can you explain why the Catechism shifts the sabbath commandment to #4, omits #3, and then divides #10 into two?
all i would like to say is "thank you". i went to an sda high school and hated every minute of it. a lot of things are very sketchy, they hide a lot under the rug and are very quick to condemn everyone else. love your brother? i think not. i married my husband and we starting going to any amazing church, not sda, and it is amazing how the Lord opened my eyes. honestly i was very jaded to the idea of "church" but again thank you God that he gave me my husband and my church. i think that there are a lot of old school sda members that are very blinded. as a matter of fact my dad started to got to my new church and felt very ashamed because he was taught sda is the only way to heaven. humm i think not. if that is they case then that is predestination..hello. abortion is wrong and it is our job to vote accordingly. thank you teresa..God bless for your braveness
Okay, well here's my opinion. :]
My mom always taught me that God has given us the gift of free will, the chance to make our own decisions. Obviously, He has also given us a set of rules to live by, a set of rules that if followed would have an immensely positive effect in our lives as well as the lives of those around us. Having said that, how can anyone tell another what choices they need to make, when God has already given us the freedom to decide for ourselves? Even if someone is making the decision to take the life of another, be it child or adult, it is not in our place to pass judgment. Personally, I believe that abortion is awful. It's terrible that it has become so easy for anyone to take the life of another :/ But again, it is not my choice. Judgment is God's alone. So, where am I going with all this rambling? I guess what I'm trying to say is that maybe the Adventist Church is just trying to be prudent. On this subject, the Church mentions, "Attitudes of condemnation are inappropriate in those who have accepted the gospel." Of course, we cannot turn a blind eye when dealing with abortion. In reality the Adventist church only condones abortion in the event that there may be "significant threats to the pregnant woman's life, serious jeopardy to her health, severe congenital defects carefully diagnosed in the fetus, and pregnancy resulting from rape or incest." Now, I don't know if anyone reading this believes and accepts the Bible in its entirety, but if you do, ponder this: Have you ever wondered why God ordered many of his faithful leaders to, (i.e. Joshua?) or why He destroyed entire cities, women, children and all(Sodom and Gomorrah)? Well, us humans, in all our sinfulness, we've done some pretty bad things. Things like incest. Incest has been a cause of child deformities for some time now (chances of bad chromosomes meeting bad chromosomes increases when family affairs occur). Sodom and Gomorrah present a fair example. Do you see where I'm going with this?
just a thought.
David,
God said to Israel, "I have set before you this day life and death (freedom of choice), therefore CHOOSE LIFE that you and your descendants may live."
God gives us a choice but He also tells us to obey HIS choice. Abortion is murder. If you believe it is simply a matter of choice, then what would you say about Stalin killing millions of Russians? Can we not condemn those murders?
A Christian church must stand up for the dignity of the incredible gift of life. If it can't stand up for the unborn innocents out there, who will it stand up for?
Here you are acting like the SDA church "promotes" abortion. I don't know of ANY church that promotes abortion. Also, a person who is pro-choice doesn't mean they're throwing out "Thou shalt not kill." It means they believe in free will, just as God gave us. If an individual doctor decides to perform abortions, that is on his head, not his church's head.
BTW, I am the anonymous from the previous posts that has a problem with your anger. I will start using my name.
Come on friends, we are missing the point! The issue about individual SDA members practicing abortion and then using that to "prove" that the SDA church does not keep "all" the ten commandments is a flawed approach. the question is as individuals, regadless of which denominations we belong to, we must love God enough to be subjected to all his ten commandments as a rule of life. And that should not be confused with legalism either.
It could have been better to read the Bible in depth from the beginning and not 40 years later, because it is apparent that the recent discoveries has not shed any freshh revelation. Friends, no one has a patent over the truth. It is pointless to reject truth because "a certain church does this and that".
If one has a problem with the ten commandments, they must attack or question God who is the author of the law and not the Sabbatarians or the SDA who are mere messengers who may out of their human weakness break some of the commandments that they are so zealosuly preaching.
If one wants to leave or join the SDA or any Sabbatarian group that is their own choce, but the question that remains is "have they kept ALL of the ten commandments?". Remember that the covenant is with God and not the SDA or any organosation. It MAY be okay Not be be a Seventh Day Adventist but IT IS DEFINATELY NOT OKAY TO BREAK ANY OF GOD'S TEN COMMANDMENTS. Any indepth Bible study within or without the SDA will reveal that! But as for me i decided to make God (the law giver) the ultimate person that i am answerable to regarding his commandments!
Pula Solomon Khunou
I agree, the SDA church isn't perfect, but the point of the SDA church was never claiming perfection, but striving towards, with one of the first steps being, we need to keep the 10 commandments and follow the Bible. The SDA never was pro abortion, and though I believe it needs to stand against it, i do not condemn it saying it doesn't keep the 10 commandments. The church isn't sweeping things under the rug, if you ask honest questions you get honest answers. If you felt slighted, lied to, and purposefully side tracked by a church member or school pastor, blame the persons own shortcomings and not the church. They're are many people claiming to be SDA, while disagreeing with SDA's stand on things. These people are in many positions in the church and give they're belief and opinion to others.
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