Praying to Mary

 Here is what Adonai says: "The earnings of Egypt, the commerce of Ethiopia, and men of stature from S'va will come over to you and become yours; they will come in chains and follow you. They will prostrate themselves before you; they will pray to you: 'Surely God is with you; there is no other, other gods are nothing.'" Isaiah 45:14 (Complete Jewish Bible)

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Protestant (shaking his head): I simply do not understand how you can worship Mary and idols. It is disgraceful and against God.

Catholic: We neither worship Mary, nor idols.

Protestant: Come on! I see you guys bowing down and praying to Mary. That is against the Bible!

Catholic: If I can show you in the bible where God Himself has people bowing down to others and praying to them, would you then re-assess your idea about Catholics?

Protestant (skeptically): It's in the Bible not to worship anything other than God. So no, its not in the Bible.

Catholic: In Isaiah 45, God specifically tells Israel that the people of surrounding nations will come before them, bow to them and pray to them. (See above text.)

Protestant: Your misinterpreting the text.

Catholic: No, look it up when you get home.
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Protestants are shocked when they discover that the words “bow” and “pray” in the Bible don’t exclusively mean worship. People bow to elders, parents, people of other nations, monarchs and angels in scripture. They even bow to inanimate things such as the Jerusalem temple and the Holy of Holies. Bowing can be used as a part of worship, but it can simply be a sign of respect for people and things.

It is the same with prayer. Note that in the Hebrew phrase above, "they will pray[palal] to you" the exact translation of the word palal (Strong’s # 06419) is an interceding prayer. 

Protestant Bibles often translate the Hebrew palal as “supplication” or “plead.”

KJV--they shall fall down unto thee, they shall make supplication unto thee... 

NAS--And will bow down to you; They will make supplication to you... 

ASV--and they shall fall down unto thee, they shall make supplication unto thee... 

NIV--will bow down before you and plead with you... 

NLT--They will fall to their knees in front of you... 

CEB--they will bow down. They will plead with you... 

ESV--bow down to you. They will plead with you,

But many translations use the word “pray.”

BBE--and they will go down on their faces before you, and will make prayer to you,  

GW--They will bow to you and pray to you, 

LEB--and they shall bow down to you; they will pray to you,    

NCV--They will bow down before you and pray to you,  

MSG--Hands folded in reverence, praying before you, 

Many of you might ask if this is the same word used for praying to God? Yes, the vast majority of the time palal is used to indicate a prayer to God. Here are some examples: 

Abraham prayed unto God [for Abimelech], Gen. 20:17.
Moses prayed unto the Lord, the fire was quenched. Nu. 11:2
 And she was in bitterness of soul, and prayed, Sam.1:10 
...they pray unto thee toward this city, 2 Chr. 6:34   
...when he prayed for his friends, Job 42:10 
...for unto thee will I pray, Ps. 5:2  
And I prayed unto the Lord, Dan. 9:4 

Before we go any further we need to stop and make this point. Even if end up disagreeing on the interpretation of this text, we can agree that this text is indeed in scripture that the Catholics didn’t make it up. Right there it says there will be bowing and praying to someone who isn’t God.

Catholic church interprets this text literally. You may choose to interpret the text another way, but you can never say that Catholics do not have a “proof-text” for their doctrine that says we can pray to others besides God.

For to Catholics this word palal is exactly what we mean when we pray to Mary and the saints. We are pleading with them, entreating them, supplicating them to intercede for us with Christ, exactly as Abraham prayed in behalf of Abimelech, Moses prayed for Israel an Job prayed for his friend in the above references.

We can ask our friends to pray for us. Indeed we can pray to God’s leaders (especially those reigning with Christ in heaven), even bowing to them, kneeling to them and supplicating them for intercessory prayer in our behalf.

This is Biblical. Catholics are praying/pleading with Mary and the saints who are right now in heaven to intercede before God for us. As we see in the text, God is quite happy with that.

They will prostrate themselves before you; they will pray to you: 'Surely God is with you; there is no other, other gods are nothing.'" Isaiah 45:14 (Complete Jewish Bible)

BE A GRAIN OF WHEAT

Unless a grain of wheat shall fall upon the ground and die, it remains but a single grain with no life. 

I have a stalk of semi-crushed wheat in a plastic bag that I use as a book mark in my Bible. It is to remind me each day at our morning devotions that as a Christian I may never see the results of my earthly pilgrimage, I may never get to see any results of my spiritual battles, that I may close my eyes in death never having believed my life made any difference and that is simply got to be okay with me. 

Americans are very results oriented. I know I am. I was taught, "Be good and you will reap a reward" day in and day out at a child. Each Cinderella gets a handsome prince, each good work gets a gold star by your name somewhere. Without knowing it America placed in me a need to see my good works displayed before men so I could be patted and cooed upon like televangelists and pastors. I wanted to be a true hero for the Lord--famous and rich--so I could give huge amounts to charity. Then I could afford to take my personal jet to third world countries and pay for water wells and food and clothing for all the poor people. Then everyone would know I loved the Lord. People would like me and think I was a great Christian.

I think many American Christians have this need to see a reward, an earthly reward, of being a Christian hero to one degree or another--some by posting cute little Facebook memes in order to be "liked." Some by mission trips or becoming a church leader.

One evening I realized that this promise of a "happily ever after" Christianity is pagan. We as Christians do our duty for God and we should expect no reward until heaven. That's a shock to an American! We work with no pay, no results? Yes. No thank-yous? No high-fives from other Christians? No Christian-of-the-month certificate? No hospital named after me? No local charity? No public award? What about my name on a gold donation plaque on the back of the pew? 

Obedience to God will mean a lifetime of spiritual battle and we may never see the end of the skirmish we are in, but we know that the battle has already been won. That is faith. We may never see any of our personal victories but with the eyes of hope.

Whatever battle you face in your life, whatever your spiritual calling, know that even if you expend yourself to exhaustion and you give and give until there is nothing more to give, you have not failed if you see no earthly results. As long as you are battling for the Lord you never battle in vain.

Be a grain of wheat. It is only after its sacrifice of death in the soil that it reaps a harvest. Never give up even if you never see the fruits of your labors for Christ. There are great surprises awaiting you in the next life.

Answer to SDA Video about Catholic Bishop's Confession

See yesterday's post.

Adventists have always misunderstood both Christian history and Catholic doctrine. They continue to re-circulate ancient quotes as if they are authoritative for Catholics and often without any understanding of what the Catholic writers even mean.

I would like to take the quotes read from this Seventh-day Adventist actor playing the part of a Catholic bishop and analyze them one by one.

Before we do, let's look at the transcript right before the beginning of this clip. SDA televangelist John Carter claims: 

46:06 And my friend who is here today is going to come and he's going to read Mr. Vincent Morton he's going to come and read from the official writings of the as they call it the holy Roman Catholic Church. Listen to this, these are the unadulterated statements from Popes and other Roman Catholic leaders.

This is patently false as you will see. None of the quotes that follow (which are on the clip) are "official" in the sense that they represent the understanding of the magisterium of the Catholic Church and Christian history. 

The Five Quotes in the Clip

Two quotes are by Catholic Redemptorist (that's what the CSSR is) Thomas Enright : 

48:03 I have repeatedly offered $1000 to anyone who can prove to me from the Bible alone that I am bound to keep Sunday holy. There is no such law in the Bible, it is a law of the holy Catholic Church alone. The Bible says remember the Sabbath day to keep it holy. The Catholic Church says no by my divine power I abolish the Sabbath day and command you to keep holy the first day of the week. And lo the entire civilized world bows down in a reverent obedience to the command of the holy Catholic Church. T. Enright C.S.S.R. in an electorate Harford Kansas,  February 18th, 1884. 

51:25 I have repeatedly offered one thousand dollars to anyone who will prove by the Bible alone that Sunday IS the day we are bound to keep, and no one has called for the money. It was the holy Catholic Church that changed the day of rest from Saturday, the seventh day, to Sunday, the first day of the week, T. Enright, C. S. S. R., in a lecture delivered in 1893.

(3ABN, Carter Report, The Priest's Confession, Part 2, Program transcript. Series code: CR, Program code: CR001105)

Note the similarities in the two quotes. The transcript gives very little information to track down the source. When I googled them, I discovered the quotes in anti-catholic sites but with differing sources. I tracked them down to the earliest SDA publication that I could find. The Signs of the Times, August 5, 1907, p. 489:

Papal Claims 

"...I will give $1000 to any man who will prove by the Bible alone that Sunday is the day we are bound to keep. . . . The observance of Sunday is "The Pope's will stands for reason. He can dispense solely a law of the Catholic Church. . . . The church changed the Sabbath to Sunday, and all the world bows down and worships upon that day, in silent obedience to the mandates of the Catholic Church."— "Father" Enright, of the College of Redemptorist Fathers, Kansas City, Mo., in Hartford (Mo.) Weekly Call, Feb. 22, 1884.

"The Catholic Church says, No! By my divine power I abolish the Sabbath day, and command you to keep holy the first day of the week. And, lo, the entire civilised world bows down in reverent obedience to the command of the holy Catholic Church !"—'Father" T. Enright, C.S.S.R., of Redemptorist College, Kansas City, Mo., in American Sentinel, June 1, 1893.

Please note the sources are different in the video and in Signs of the Times (Hartford, Mo. vs. Hartford, Ks). Even the wording has changed somewhat. Yet the Signs of the Times gives additional information that make it easier to verify the authenticity of the quote.

Therefore, after investigation we can dismiss the quotes because: 

• There was no record of a Redemptorist named Thomas Enright at that time. (The Catholics keep records.) [NOTE: update--someone sent me a link of a obituary of a Redemptorist Timothy Enright that may the guy.]
• The Signs of the Times second quote sources the American Sentinel which is problematic because the Philadelphia newspaper shut down in 1840.  

[* UPDATE: A man sent me a link with a scan of two letters where this man "Father Enright" challenged that he would pay anyone who could find a proof-text for Sunday. However, the scan of the letter never indicated that it was in a lecture. ("Lecture" must have been a typo) So, the guy may be a legitimate priest, we however are not sure about the context of the personal letter.]

Let's deal with the other three quotes as a group because they are all legitimate Catholic writers in legitimate Catholic periodicals. 

49:03 The Catholic Church for over one thousand years before the existence of a Protestant by virtue of her divine mission changed the day from Saturday to Sunday the Catholic Mirror, Sep. 23rd, 1893. 

49:22 Question, which is the Sabbath day? Answer, Saturday is the Sabbath day. Question, why do we observe Sunday instead of Saturday? Answer, we observe Sunday instead of Saturday, because the Catholic Church in the Council of Laodicea 336A.D. transferred the solemnity from Saturday to Sunday. Peter Giermann, Converts Catechism, 1910, page 50. 

50:01 Question, have you any other way of proving that the church has power to institute festivals of precept? Answer, has she not such power she could not have done that in which all modern religionists agree with her. She could not have substituted the observance of Sunday the first day of the week for the observance of Saturday the seventh day. The change for which there is no scriptural authority. Stephen Keenan, 'A Doctrinal Catechism' page 174, [1846]

These three publications, even with the nil obstat  or imprimatur in no way gives them the authority of the Catholic Church. It just means that there is no heresy that the bishop could find in the book. These labels are not infallible and never were thought to be. Catholic books with the thumbs up from bishops can and do have these "thumbs ups" removed. Samuele Bacchiocci's book was eventually stripped of its imprimatur. 

Think about this, a hundred years from now someone trying to prove the SDA church hates science and no members can believed in evolution may publish this quote to prove it:

"As long as you stick to the Bible (and Ellen White's books and articles) you will not go wrong. For those among us who have already decided--despite the Bible and Ellen White--on evolution, there are plenty of other churches for you. Ours isn't one." Cliff Goldstein, Adventist Review July 24, 2003

Cliff Goldstein is a bona fide leader of the SDA church. He is an employee of the General Conference and speaks for the church. The Adventist Review is a church publication, right?

Actually, Cliff is expressing his opinion, even in this church publication. Catholic priests can do that and do so all the time. The above quotes are just that. The quotes in the clip are from individual Catholics giving their opinions even in Catholic periodicals. But they cannot be used to prove Catholic doctrine. 

Let me explain just a bit more. The Sabbatarian Sabbath was really not an issue for a thousand years. Sixteenth-century puritans began arguing among each other about a Sunday Sabbath or a Saturday Sabbath. Even priests in America and Great Britain were drug into the argument without being educated, because frankly, sabbatarianism wasn't high on their priority list. 

So, if you truly want to know what the Catholics believe, don't go back any further than Pope John Paul II's encyclical, Dies Domini. He dealt thoroughly with this subject and this is the official,  (as John Carter said earlier) "unadulterated" Catholic doctrines. Use this to form your understanding about Catholic beliefs on the Sabbath. 

http://www.vatican.va/holy_father/john_paul_ii/apost_letters/documents/hf_jp-ii_apl_05071998_dies-domini_en.html

Those quotes are simply not relevant to the subject. 

The bishop is fictional. 
The authority given these quotes is fictional. 

If you want truth... what Catholics really believe? To the current Catechism and Magisterium you go! Ask the Vatican!